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Author: Subject: A Sincere Argument for the Reinstatement of TopTenPro
borntorun
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 08:55 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
A Sincere Argument for the Reinstatement of TopTenPro

Although Iím usually a joking guy who makes few serious posts, the following is spoken from the heart and is absolutely not at all in jest. Some of you may hate me for the following argument, but Iím willing to go out on a limb for this one.

TopTenPro should be allowed back.

Now, before you all go apeshit over the very thought of OOís Most Wanted making a comeback, hear me out. Iím not saying you have to like him. If you donít want to go out of your way to be nice to him, then thatís fine. Hell, feel free to just ignore his posts if thatís what you feel like (and that would be my suggestion). To me, it all boils down to the fact that as much as many of us loathed him, he was really harmless wrestling fan who did not know the right way to get his messages across. Although he didnít adapt to the environment the first time, there was no need to kill him off. Iíd rather he either found his own way out the door or just post into obscurity until he tired of it.

However, before I go on I need to make a few things clear. 1) Iím making this plea to you all and not directly to the Mods because itís really the opinion of the masses that will make the decision. The chances of him being banned in the first place would be significantly lower without the flames spewing from the keyboards of the veterans. I honestly mean no disrespect to the Mods: they do a wonderful job. It wouldnít be productive anyway because of the public backlash for a sudden reinstatement. And I do understand banning is a very touchy subject, so I donít envy the Mods. 2) I know I posted as much vitriol against him as anybody when he was still around. More on that later. 3) This will not be a ďholier than thouĒ speech where I claim moral superiority over all. In fact, I wish to lift mine as well. And I know there are many of you who have been around way longer than me, and encountered this before. Defending territory is part of the OO tradition, and a fine one at that. I may not get into it here, but I think that the jingOOism causes many of the inconveniences we get from the newbies. Anyway, onto the argument.

The fact of the matter is TopTenPro was banned because he was an idiot. I wonít dispute that. But it was kind of an innocent naivety, donít you think? Sure, he posted some threads that many of us thought were worthless or a waste of time. I know I didnít really care for them. On the other hand, many of us (myself included) countered with even more pointless responses that just perpetuated the stupidity. Despite all that, he still kept talking about wrestling, and he admittedly did start a few conversations that went rather well. I think a tweak in his writing style and subject matter would suit him fine, and now Iíd rather help than simply hate.

So far, his main crimes are writing poorly, sounding like an idiot, and acting pompous in many of his posts. Most of us donít like any of that, but there are quite a few on the boards that act that way and are safe because weíve earned the respect. Iím not so easy anymore with the tremendous double-standard; although Iíve only been here for 7 months or so, it seems to be getting harder and harder to gain respect. We dole out the punishment, swear, criticize his arguably inane writing, and flat out insult the guy. Did he leave? Did he retaliate? Did he spam? No, he simply kept doing what he was doing. He may not have gotten any better, but he really didnít get that much worse. And in retrospect, it wasnít the worst that he could be doing.

Iím not going to lie: one of the main reasons Iím writing this is because he emailed me and asked if I would speak up for him; I really donít think he understands that stupidity can get you booted. On top of that, itís apparent that he really enjoys coming here, despite the criticism. The first thing he said was ďI feel like the most hated guy on the boards.Ē While that didnít exactly make me shed a tear, I gained respect for him for the simple fact that at least he knew what he was getting into and didnít really bitch about it. He knew his role on the food chain, and despite his bacterial status he was the best damn bacterium he could be. While I still donít know why he chose me, all that adds a point in my book.

I know Iíve rambled and I havenít come up with anything more solid other than, ďheís not that bad.Ē The fact that weíve celebrated his departure like he was an unwelcome STD is a bit disheartening, but thatís not really the issue. I guess my thing is this: I personally donít mind a little bit of hazing, and a guy who can roll with the punches is an asset to our community. If he can take my statement about his mom losing a match between a vacuum cleaner and a coat hanger without getting upset, then heís ok in my book. To me, he did that. While he may not deserve unanimous praise, I think it should be okay to give him a second chance. I think this was a good warning, and it would serve him well to heed it.

In the end, if you want to keep flaming and starting shit with him, thatís fine. Iíll probably read it, laugh, and move on, just as TTP seems to do. Just keep in mind he never came back with it (as far as I know), thus limiting the reach of his universally known idiocy. If you donít care for his posts, you can go ahead and let him know, or just donít respond to him. Thatís democratic enough. The point of all this is the following: Let him post his stuff, and if he doesnít take constructive criticism to heart, then Iíll join the crusade against him. But I think this was a fair wake-up call for him to realize the environment his is in and hopefully us all to adapt a little bit.

So, Iíd like to hear your thoughts. Once again Mods, Iím sorry if this seems rebellious, but I really feel like a lot (not just TopTenPro) needs to be discussed. For the rest of you, if you agree, please jot down your thoughts. If you disagree, please do so in a nice debatable manner. And if you think Iím just a fucking idiot for going to bat for OOís version of Satan, let me know here or in a u2u. Thanks for your time.

Edit: Of course, if had dual identities and stuff like that, then of course I want him gone. And then I'd look like the jackass. Oh well.

[Edited on 2-10-2004 by borntorun]





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Operation Retard
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:53 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
oh look, BTR is gettin all eogahnn on us.

just kiddin there

but onto the subject of TTP. i'll actually start off with positives about him. for starters, the man reaaly did seem to just want to talk about wrestling. he pretty much stayed out of the off topic forums, and posted threads in their appropriate wrestling forum. it's also safe to say he wasn't a troll or a flamer (at least not in the "person who likes to flame" sense of the word). and he did seem to just take what was thrown at him and move on. these are all perfectly acceptable traits in a poster IMO. also the one piece of criticism he actually listened to: we said quit with the fucking lists and he quit with the fucking lists

so what went wrong? was it his obvious preference of old time wrestling? no, that's why we the old time wrestling forum. but his constant insistance that we were wrong for not having this same preference wasn't making him any friends. or his "why cant wrestling be like it used to be" posts that he kept bringing on even though we've told him plenty that we dont want it to be like it used to. we've excepted that times change, and so does wrestling.

and while he may roll with the punches fine, he either completely ignores or pushes farther the criticism thats included with those punches. whenb someone says "stop acting like a fucking know it all you fucking cunt whore", he takes to being called a fucking cunt whore fine, but then seems to embrace the "know it all" part as if it were a compliment, or worse a gimmick, instead of realizing it's the reason he's beiing called a fucking cunt whore in the first place. and it's that condescending attitude that was in all of his posts that really pissed people off.

also there's the "start 10 new threads in one day where only 1 is worth a damn." now i'll admit, prolly only 1 of every 10 threads i start is worth a damn, but the difference is i dont start em all in one day knocking down other threads that people are interested in.

and here's the final thing i'll say. most simply just dont like him. now while the stupidity rule -which we all know he certainly broke- is a written rule, i've found in my time here there's the unwritten "because we dont like you" rule. i'm certainly not gonna speak for the mods, but from my observations, it seems when someone is severely disliked, even though they're far from a ryan o riley, they're deemed more trouble than they're worth and booted. they may mean no harm, but if all they do in incite flames, it just muddies up the board with threads of flame after flame.

i'm personally happy to see him gone, because intentionally or not, he hasn't brought anything positive to the table. and he's a tool.

thats all i have to say on the subject, so now, unless he's reinstated, i will not speak of TTP again. unless of course the subject of annoying posters is brought up






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BoerboelLVR
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 01:56 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Look, I know that BTR is not the only one who feels this way about TTP, but I'd like to say my piece.

Right before TTP was banned, I'd spent the entire day reading through the CtB and Old Timey/ask The Rick topics. I found a number of TTP posts that although the subject matter could have been used in a good discussion, well the tone of his posts were annoying.

It's one thing if you post a topic and then someone else posts counterpoint and then discussion (and sometimes hilarity) ensues. But when you post a topic and someone posts counterpoint and then you post back to tell them that your opinion is the right one without really offing more than that, well that's annoying. This is what TTP does. He may be an idiot, but when he does this, he knows he is doing it.

This type of non-discussion (if you will) would be easier to ignore if it didn't exists in almost every TTP post. To tell you the truth, I would have liked to have participated more in some of the discussions started by TTP but when I read through the posts, by the time I got to the end, I only felt like telling him to "FUCK OFF." There are/were others on these forums who can be or have been annoying (maybe myself included, who knows.) However, no other poster on theses boards has ever annoyed me to the point of swearing at them the way TTP did.

One of the things that will get you banned according to the board rules is "Stupidity." Now it doesn't say stupidity in combonation with anything else, just stupidity. Now you may ask, "How stupid do you have to be?" The answer is apparently, "Stupid enough to draw the attention of the Mods." Nobody called for the banning of TTP. I told him to fuck off and leave, but I never went to a moderator and asked for him to be removed. That was a moderator decision. I wasn't the only one (though maybe the harshest one) flaming TTP either. The fact was, he was acting stupid. He was being an annoyance. And the Moderators did what they felt was necessary.

The last thing I will say is this. If TTP is re-instated here, I will accept the re-instatement, but I will not accept TTP's attitude. I don't think his attitude will change so even if he comes back, things may not change much and he'll find himself banned again. He should just create a new screen name, quietly log back on to the boards and keep a very low profile if he wants to come back. The TTP name is tainted (heh heh, I said taint) now and even if he changed his attitude, it may not change the way others receive him upon his return. If he comes back, I'll try to ignore him, but I'm not making any promises.

I'm done.

[Edited on 2-10-2004 by BoerboelLVR]





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markout
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 04:34 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
The fact of the matter is that the guy took pains to be deliberately insulting in his initial posts. How many of his opening threads had something to the effect of "I am a smart, who knows how it really is while all of you wannabe smarks have been brainwashed by years of Scott Keith. Marks are not worth my time. I am here to spread enlightenment whether you want it or not."

This board has been up for the better part of two years and in that time, has developed its own voice and attitude. When somebody comes in and deliberately provokes hostility with remarks insulting that voice and attitude, and does not desist despite warnings and attempts to dissuade him from doing so, then yes he deserves to be banned. While you state that some of his inanity led to actual discussion (which I'd have to see to believe and I did read most of his posts before going after him), that in and of itself does not excuse the arrogant and proselytizing attitude he took towards his discussions. They were just as likely to draw the ire of the posters here as they were an intelligent response.

It had nothing to do with being a "new" guy. Nobody who has been here any length of time will post with that attitude. It had everything to do with being a dick. Good riddance.





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2HoT
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 05:10 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I am afraid I have to agree with Markout. TTP certainly knows a lot about wrestling. That is not the stupidity rule he broke. He exhibited an extreme naivety with respect to human interaction. No one likes being patronized. His condecending attitude and his stubborn refusal to knock it off is what got him banned.

I do not support reinstatement in this matter. Partly because his contribution does not warrant it, and partly because Mods are like referees. In order for them to have any credibility, their acts must be just (and I believe they were in this case) and their decisions must be final.

This is not a democracy.





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Laner
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 05:30 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I agree that he wasn't a blatant troll, but his social skills (such as they are on an anonymous message board) were incredibly lacking.

How's that for a non-answer?






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OOMatt
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 05:51 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I promised Btr that I had his back on this one, and I'll make good on that promise.

OO seems to enjoy being a secret club. If you don't know the pass word or know somebody who does, then you're pretty well screwed. Newbies, no matter what their level of knowledge, are open to being flamebait. There are certainly benefits to such exclusivity, but I don't think they really outweigh the negatives here.

Was TopTenPro a prick? Yeah. But so what? I mean, really, if you couldn't take his smarmier than thou attitude then you should just get off the internet right now. There are some VERY popular regulars who have the exact same attitude. Hell, I'd say that I can come off that way on some issues. The guy hadn't been here long enough to find that delicate niche between know it all smark and catering to the whims of regulars, and even if he hadn't, I hardly find it grounds for banning. He only really turned on the pissing and moaning when it was obvious that everyone here wanted him gone, but nobody had done anything about it, and really, many people when faced with that situation would react much the same way. The guy wanted to talk about his standpoint on wrestling, and we wanted a new toy to insult, and that's what went down.

Honestly, if I weren't a columnist here, I would probably have gone much the same way as TopTenPro. Because I have such strong views on what is the entertainment in "sports entertainment" and because those views don't mesh well with others here, I'd probably get run out of town by committee in a few days. Not that I probably would have registered because I would have taken one look at how we treat new guys and said "its not worth it." The thing is, I have an in. I'm already kind of relevant because my name appears once a week on a byline on the main site. He doesn't have that benefit.

I tend to think we're a good bunch of guys and girls. I really do enjoy all the personalities and opinions here. I just think we're a little trigger happy when it comes to new people, especially new people who come in without respect for our unwritten laws and traditions, and rather than try to cultivate an understanding with them, we just break out the banning sticks.

[Edited on 2-10-2004 by OOMatt]






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outback jack
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 05:57 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
His initial posts in most threads were OK. The problem was that whatever you posted in response seemed to draw such a hostile response from him. Early on, people would write something like "I disagree with #7 on your list" and he'd come back right away with cracks about riding on the short bus and other stuff usually saved for when a flame war has escalated.

Having thought about what BTR wrote, if he comes back but chills out I'd be OK with it, with the same proviso about dual identities.






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markout
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 06:07 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
It's one thing to have strong views. It's one thing to stand by your strong views when others disagree with them. All of that is fine. We like that. (the royal we, anyways)

It's completely another thing to behave like a total ass to promote your views. If your want people to take you viewpoint seriously (and if you are posting it on a message board, you do) then let the argument stand for itself. While people may not agree with it and vehemently attack the premises, they will generally respect it. It's only when a holier-than-thou attitude accompanies such an opinion that people get turned off to such arguments.

I've seen us flame off new people that don't adjust. I have also seen new people tone it down and become very well-respected and intelligent contributors to many discussions. We would all prefer that the latter happen in all cases, but this isn't a perfect world and the former is always a very real possibility.

I don't feel bad about running off someone who can't adequately articulate their point of view without being insulting. Whether by lack of skill or contrivance, TTP just couldn't let his arguement stand without injecting his self-superior attitude into it.

Like 2HoT said, this isn't a democracy.

EDITED because I've become too reliant on Word Spell Check

[Edited on 2-10-2004 by markout]





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benoitbrokemyneck
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 06:30 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I kinda have sympathy fo the guy. I too had a rather shaky start here, and even made an entire thread called "Jeb Is An Ass" quite early on. After that I quicky pissed off kyle by (jokingly) wishing harm to a wrestler, and then I invaded the rather tight knit CE with my 1,293 word replies that I am sure rubbed a few of the vets the wrong way. Even before that I had several inane posts and oft times just posted crap in the wrong section. Generally speaking I was (and still am at times) an ass of sorts, and have never been close to being banned.

I just thought his banning was rather abrupt, usually I can see a banning coming a mile away, this time it just seemed to come outta nowhere. Then again I don't read much in the CtB where he seemed to hang out, so maybe it was a good call.

I'm just glad I didn't get a banning stick across my head so abruptly, cuz I could've been outta here a long time ago.

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Thom
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 06:51 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Well, I'm not sure I'm the right person to jump in on this conversation, especially since it's all been said...

However, I think that if the Mods gave him any warning (u2u, e-mail, whatever), and he continued in his ways, fuck him... If, on the other hand, he just woke up some day and was banned, then perhaps a second chance is in order.

Of course, I could be way off the mark, as I didn't really read too many of his posts... Take that as what you will.





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markout
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 06:52 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
It seems like he was banned not for being a jerk necessarily, but not realizing that people were taking him to task for being a jerk. He started vehemently complaining when people didn't flame what he considered to be a "mark" new poster question in "Ask the Rick". he was under the impression that he was getting shit because he was new, not because he was an ass. This led to him being a bigger ass and it appeared that the mods had just had enough of it, since it had gotten to the point where one of his posts could completely derail a thread with sudden invective towards him.

So technically he wasn't banned for being stupid or being a prick, rather for being stupid about his prickness. But I don't know.





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2HoT
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 07:24 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
People really need to get over this "getting flamed because he/she is a newbie" attitude because it is just a bunch of crap. Do lots of newbies get flamed? Yes, but so do lots of vets. Operation Retard is one of the longest running posters on this board and I flame his sorry ass all the time (mostly in chat, but boardside when opportunity knocks). I take shots at Slade on a semi-regular basis. And lest we forget BFG. On the other hand, there are people like Borntorun who never had any trouble at all as a newbie. (His trouble came later when he went on this Billy Gunn kick but that is neither here nor there) I personally flamed Angstboy when he was new and he has since gone on to become one of our most valued members.

The fact of the matter is this; I don't care if you are the newest poster on the boards or if you are the almighty Rick. If you say something stupid, I will tell you it is stupid. If you act like an asshole, I will call you an asshole. If you insult me, it will be returned. If you refuse to cease insulting me, I will tear you a new one. I am not trigger happy when it comes to newbies. I am extremely trigger happy when it comes to assholes and idiots. I do not flame people for no reason. Rarely could I be accused of taking unwarranted cheap shots.

It is no secret how we treat not just newbies but each other in general. I am sure that Boerboel doesn't find our "sweaty man-love" references as amusing as the rest of us, but he takes them in good humor. This is why I strongly recommend people lurking for a while before they start posting. They owe it to themselves to be educated about the idiosyncracies and pitfalls that this board offers. I also don't think that this should only be true of this board but any and all messageboards one wishes to join. It's just good sense. I like this board a lot, and I sure as hell don't want it to suddenly become a friggen Care Bears convention.

If you don't like the way we act, then tough shit. This place probably isn't for you. There are plenty of other options out there.





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Antelope
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 07:45 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by markout
it had gotten to the point where one of his posts could completely derail a thread with sudden invective towards him.


I think this is the real problem and the reason that he got banned. While he undoubtedly *wanted* to talk wrestling, his attitude (as has been discussed at length already) prevented that. Finally, it got to the point where evryone was so pissed at him that we couldn't talk about wrestling, because he pissed everyone off and conversation ended. To me, that's cause for banning as it stiffles all conversation, which is what we're all here for.

As for the general tone of the boards - I don't fully get this whole "We're too harsh on newbies" argument. First off - none of us were born here and all started off as newbies. But we've all persisted because we learned how to talk to one another and have conversations. There are lots of wrestling boards out there and each one has a different vibe. If you want to be all smarky and rude to everyone, there's the DVDVR message board (and if you think we're a hard clique to get into try THAT one). But here we don't go for that - and I think that's OK, that's why there are choices for different boards.

That said, it's true - we do jump on newbies quickly here, but we also quickly accept them once they make intelligent arguments and posts. Look at the "Undertaker" thread in Ask the Rick for a good example. I think the newbie-hating comes from us getting burned a bit in the past few months, so we're a bit more cautious and jumpy now. Which is a shame, but I think will pass.

And my last point - if TTP really wants to contribute, then I htink he should read this thread, come in under a new name, and start talking about wrestling without the attitude. If he does that, we'll gladly talk to him.

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BoerboelLVR
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 07:46 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
After reading all these different views, I can't help but think that this being taken further than it needs to go. In the end of it all, you are not going to like everyone who posts on these boards. Sure we all try to get along for the most part, but I'm sure that each of us can name someone on these boards that we feel just a little dislike towards.

The difference is we all try to be mature about things. Every once in a while we lose a bit of that maturity and it detiorates into a flame war, but it is the level of intelligence and maturity on these boards that has brought most of us together. even if we don't like each other, there is a common ground of respect. If that makes a "Secret Exclusive Club" then so be it.

When someone new comes to these boards, I hope that they do lurk for a while and I hope that they do read as many of the posts as possible and I hope that they can read and understand the respect that we give each other. Then they sign up and they begin posting and hopefully they can gain respect from us. But some folks just decide that they deserve our respect even if they don't show respect to us. That's what TTP did.

Do you want to know something? Go look at the last two or three pages of the member list. there are some names on there that are a becoming regular posters. Do you know what else, there a very few names that have the words "banned" after them. We are not running off or hazing every new poster that comes here. We are hazing the folks who come here with no respect for these forums or the people posting in them.

I've gone on a rant again, but the bottom line is this: If you can't come here and show at least a little respect for the others on this board, then you don't deserve to stick around as long as everybody else.

If the Mods ban you, then you are banned. If they feel that that's they way it should be, then that is the way it should be. They don't have to give us any reason why one is banned while another is not. And we should have no say otherwise.





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2HoT
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 08:02 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by BoerBoelLVR

If the Mods ban you, then you are banned. If they feel that that's they way it should be, then that is the way it should be. They don't have to give us any reason why one is banned while another is not. And we should have no say otherwise.



AMEN!!!





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ModSquad004
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:06 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I've been wanting to ban 2Hot for the longest time, but 002 won't let me.

TTP was in the dog house (no pun intended) for quite some time for things covered above. As far as myself, I got irked by a particular U2U to us complaining about me and my abuse of power after I made a joke on one of early his posts. I told him not to worry about being banned, unless he gave us reason to. This was way back when he had maybe 10-20 posts and was a supreme condesending ass at the time. Why anyone with that surly of an attitude would want to draw attention to himself to us is beyond me.

For the record, I was not the one who banned TTP, but I 100% support the action and the reasons behind it. However, I also support Borntorun's desire to discuss this matter (and in quite the civil manner, I must say). I want you guys to be able to say if you agree or disagree with our actions.

joke-
So I tried to ban myself for my behavior (abusing power and such), but apparently, the stick doesn't work on me. All I did was bruise my forehead a couple times.
-endjoke


Since we're having an open forum about this, I want to know. Have you ever felt that I (not ModPrime or 002, but me, myself, and I) ever abused my power? I never felt I have, but maybe I'm wrong?





WOOF!

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outback jack
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:09 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
004, aside from the time you stole those beers from Lucky's cooler I'd say no






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markout
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:15 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Since we're having an open forum about this, I want to know. Have you ever felt that I (not ModPrime or 002, but me, myself, and I) ever abused my power? I never felt I have, but maybe I'm wrong?


That depends. Are you the one that made us all wear nametags?





Do NOT fuck with my chi.

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ModSquad004
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:25 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Are you the one that made us all wear nametags?

Yes, that was me. But I thought you guys were ok with that since I had the large assortment of colored markers to write your name with.





WOOF!

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markout
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:43 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
But I thought you guys were ok with that since I had the large assortment of colored markers to write your name with.


But mine says "makeout"...





Do NOT fuck with my chi.

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AnglesGoldMedals
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:53 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
My 20p regarding TTP...

I think itís fair to say that TTP made a lot of enemies with the attitude he displayed in his first few posts, and never really recovered.

Some of us on the forums have been lucky Ė They have never been flamed.

Others received a bit of grief - I remember Bonestein and 2Hot trying it on with me near the beginning of my time here. Somebody even screwed about with my avatar (turning me into a smurf no less!) Ė But I guess I was lucky, the ďhazingĒ soon stopped, and (I think) I was accepted into the group... Either that or people just started to ignore me. And for the record, I prefer the WWF of Ď85-95 to todayís product.

Some, like nilesanderson, got massive grief but managed to ride the storm to become respected and valuable posters.

Some, like BFG and probably eoghann, have drifted away from the forums, possibly because of the extent of the flaming which can occur.

Others, like TTP and Cuddlemonkey were banned. Despite bringing some fairly original thoughts to the table, their ďdistinctive attitudesĒ didnít allow their styles to blend with some of us.

For what itís worth, I adopted the ďdonít replyĒ method with most of TTPís threads. Some of what he said, like the Royal Rumble thread, did provoke thoughts in me, but by then I had promised to myself that I would not post in his threads until his attitude changed.

Ultimately, his attitude didnít change. Whether his attitude would have changed over time is open to debate. What can be said is that TTP will never get the chance to show that his attitude could change.

In that respect I wholeheartedly agree with Antelopes sentiment:-
"TTP really wants to contribute, then I think he should read this thread, come in under a new name, and start talking about wrestling without the attitude. If he does that, we'll gladly talk to him."





Now with 20% less Kellett...

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BoerboelLVR
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 09:56 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
004, I don't believe you or any of the Mods have shown an abuse of power. Sometimes you must be assertive and that goes with the territory.

The few times that I have been contacted by the Mods, I feel it was always done with care and respect. I never felt that there was ever an abuse of power towards me. Others may feel differently, I don't know and I can't speak for them. But for me, it's all been fair. I appreciate that all of our Mods listen to us and I hope that they will always consider our suggestions, but as I said before, once a Mod makes a decision, I'm going to do my best to respect it.

And I still can't figure out why my name tag says "I <3 SML" What does that mean?





Don't touch me there!

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2HoT
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 10:31 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
I've been wanting to ban 2Hot for the longest time



Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee...



*sneaks up behind AGM*

*WHACK~!!!*

*lays him out with a brutal chairshot for old times sake*





Who wants soup?

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ModSquad002
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posted on 2-10-2004 at 10:57 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Besides, if the kid wants to register under a different name and clean up his act, he is certainly free to.





предавать меня не

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