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Author: Subject: OOfficial Discussion Thread for: RAW (October 14, 2019)
OORick
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posted on 10-14-2019 at 10:27 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
OOfficial Discussion Thread for: RAW (October 14, 2019)

Tonight on RAW: the 2019 Draft comes to an end, sort of.... with a trading window introduced last week, and with several major stars on an ineligible injury list (to become free agents), rosters will only be MOSTLY set at the end of tonight...

According to WWE, this is the list of stars eligible tonight (unlike last Friday, this list is alphabetical, and does not accidentally spoil the draft order, which WWE has had more than enough time to alter, anyway):

Aleister Black
Ali
Andrade
AOP (Akam & Rezar)
Apollo Crews
SD Women's Champ Bayley
WWE Champion Brock Lesnar
Buddy Murphy
Carmella
Charlotte Flair
Cedric Alexander
Curt Hawkins & Zack Ryder
Dana Brooke
Daniel Bryan
Drake Maverick
Raw Tag Team Champions Dolph Ziggler & Robert Roode
Elias
Erick Rowan
Fire & Desire (Mandy Rose & Sonya Deville)
King Corbin
Jinder Mahal
Liv Morgan
Luke Harper
Mojo Rawley
The Miz
No Way José
Rey Mysterio
R-Truth
Rusev
Samoa Joe
Universal Champion Seth Rollins
Sarah Logan
Shelton Benjamin
Intercontinental Champion Shinsuke Nakamura (with Sami Zayn)
The IIconics (Billie Kay & Peyton Royce)
WWE Women’s Tag Team Champions The Kabuki Warriors (Asuka & Kairi Sane)
The New Day (Kofi Kingston, Big E & Xavier Woods)
Titus O’Neil

As was the case on Friday, RAW will open with a match to determine draft order... RAW Women's Champ (and already re-drafted to RAW) Becky Lynch will face Charlotte (representing SD, but able to be drafted to either brand tonight)... Charlotte is a late replacement for Sasha Banks, who was drafted to SD on Friday, but who is dealing with a minor injury issue...

Some picks seem like no brainers, as SD needs to pick their own Women's Champ (Bayley) and IC Champ (Shinsuke Nakamura), lest there be major title overload.... likewise, both WWE Champ Brock Lesnar and WWEU Champ Seth Rollins are in tonight's draft pool, and each brand needs to end up with one of them (and yes, SD and FOX are the ones with the chest-penis-sized hard-on for Brock)... women's tag title is still a bit of a mystery, as it had been cross-brand, but is now apparently going to be brand-specific, in which case, RAW seems a better fit, since WWE has already made it clear that RAW's roster will be the bigger of the two, allowing for more women's tag combos...

The only other announced match so far for tonight is a tag title match in which Bobby Roode and Dolph Ziggler (eligible to be drafted tonight) defend against the Viking Warriors (already drafted to RAW)... obviously, RAW needs to keep their titles at home, but if the Vikings win, they don't need to burn a pick on Roode/Ziggler, so just seomthing to think about...

Something I'd also wager heavily upon: Miz drafted to RAW, just because he's in a USA Network "reality" show, and I doubt either network would be happy if he wound up drafted to FOX's brand...

Besides the draft, the narrative focus of tonight's show will be on the upcoming Dirrrty Money in the Desert PPV from Saudi Arabia.... the two big singles matches for the show are (assuming Lesnar is drafted to SD) both SD branded, but the third major attraction is a 5-on-5 match that will end up being cross-branded.... expect "Team Flair" and "Team Hogan" to continue taking shape tonight (gut feeling: if the rumors about Edge are true, this looks like a nice soft landing spot for him; better than immediately jumping into a singles match, anyway)...

Beyond that? Who the hell knows.... from what I gather, that includes WWE, who ended up -- in true Stable Genius Fashion -- making way more up on the fly last week than you would imagine given what a major week it was and how long they had to plan for it... so why change now, when it's work oh so well?

That is all. End communication.

The flOOr is yours, OO Nation. Don't wait till after 11pm to post, either. Pre-show previewing and prognosticating is certainly welcome. So discuss, debate, and rate!

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Il Palazzo
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 12:06 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Well, looks like we might not need to consider where Mike Kanellis is going during the draft (if anyone was wondering about that to begin with), as he seems to have asked for his release today. On one hand, I kind of found him a bit more interesting in WWE than I did during his RoH stint before that, but on the other they didn't really use him beyond a certain point, also all of that recent relationship nonsense. Which is now over, presumably. Makes me wonder if this isn't why they started that new stupid thing with Rusev, Lana, and Lashley, assuming there was any sign of him wanting out before that kicked off.

Edit: Aw, WWE has to spend more time talking about that match.

Edit II: Hooray, the war room crap persists into tonight too! And Jim Cramer's soundboard thing! And this is so meh!

Edit III: I feel like it's too early to start harping on this, but fuck it. This draft is still fairly obvious. We've had a handful of people switch brands, but it's still mostly just people staying on the shows they were on to begin with. And the usual element of "we might see some teams broken up!!!!!111111111111" being tossed out over and over again.

[Edited on 10-15-2019 by Il Palazzo]





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janerd75
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 12:41 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Are those "executives" wearing the same clothes they were on Friday? It's almost as though they're using pre-taped footage for the continuation of this draft hullabalooza.

Also, I'd sooner take investment advice from the Bernies, either Sanders or Madoff, before Jim F. Cramer.





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 12:41 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Watching Comcast bring in their entire corporate portfolio to push WWE must make Vince giddy. Hell in a Raptor Cell, Minion vs Midget match, Roman getting targeted by Dominic Toretto.





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Il Palazzo
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 12:43 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Yeah, but they can't make sound effects on demand.

Also, I'll choose to imagine that the reason the "executives" are potentially still in the same clothing from three days ago is because they've been locked in those rooms the entire time.





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 12:48 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Hey...at least the RAW announce team is cheering for their brand.

Also...Aleister Black*, Andrade, Mr O’Shea, Owens, and AJ all on one show means at least RAW can put out some tippy top matches to fill 3 hours.

*Black was headed for RAW the moment that Charlotte (and therefor Andrade w/ Vega) was drafted to RAW, since they don’t want to break couples up.

Also...either Kofi or Big E are going to need to be a main event era on SmackDown the way things have gone down.

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Il Palazzo
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 12:58 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Shocking, Rusev's able to continue that horrid thing with Lashley. And the SD Women's champ staying on SD? WHERE'S THE LOGIC??? HERP DERP! Although thinking about it, if a show-specific champion moved brands, would the title come with them or be vacated? I know the other choice is to just have the opposing champions switch brands so you don't double up on something.

I did miss having a more serious draft set-up, but this has been both too over the top with the assorted canned footage of people in rooms and non-wrasslin' people. And far too much of people being announced to just stay where they are followed by people acting like this is an amazing thing.

Edit: And with that, I'm guessing that Ziggler and/or Roode are headed to SD.

[Edited on 10-15-2019 by Il Palazzo]





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bigfatgoalie
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 01:18 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I’m guessing Ziggler to SmackDown. Roode stays on RAW to job out to younger dudes.

Also...outside of the Draft stuff, this show has featured some quality wrestling.

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Il Palazzo
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 01:38 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
So the draft can't even split up tag teams that feel temporary in nature. WOOOOOOO!

Also, does this mean the 24/7 Title is locked to Raw?

Edit: I already don't want a follow-up to any of that.

Edit II: I SAID I DIDN'T WANT A FOLLOW-UP TO ANY OF THAT. DON'T YOU LISTEN, RAW.

Edit III: Was the pen snapping meant to be a joke? Because I'd say if so, mission accomplished. Goofy either way.

Edit IV: So I guess USA has to send Miz & Mrs. to Fox now? Also interesting with Tozawa headed to Raw, since I guess maybe that means 205 Live is probably deader than anticipated. Or was he on Raw or SD? I'm pretty sure for a while the only former 205 guys running around Raw and SD were Murphy, Alexander, and Ali. And I guess LHP.

[Edited on 10-15-2019 by Il Palazzo]





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 02:21 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by OORick

Something I'd also wager heavily upon: Miz drafted to RAW, just because he's in a USA Network "reality" show, and I doubt either network would be happy if he wound up drafted to FOX's brand...




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Il Palazzo
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 02:33 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Hell yeah! Raw is keeping a guy that doesn't do shit anyway!

And I missed seeing the actual re-christening of Shorty Gable last week, but the fact they're sticking with it is irritating. But then, he's on the same show as Corbin, so I guess that makes some sense. As long as they don't magically drop the feud.

Also yay! Liv Morgan! Maybe NOW she'll get to do shit again.

Edit: I was prepared for Natalya to bring out a partner that mattered, sure that would mean Ye Olde Kabuki Warriors' title reign was already ending. But considering she picked a partner who got drafted to SD, nevermind!

Edit II: I have admittedly forgotten if this was a title match or not! But being reminded about the titles being defended on both shows, I suppose it's not impossible Natalya and Lacey will win after all. You can get a lot out of that outcome, by creating tag champs that are split between shows, tag champs that are presumably at odds with each other, AND the added bonus of screwing over Asuka and Kairi Sane again! THERE'S LITERALLY NO DOWNSIDE.

Edit III: Hooray! Also with that particular phrasing, I guess maybe that wasn't a title match after all. And now we get to sign off for the night with Bray, so that works.

Edit IV: I was a bit premature on that. I guess it makes sense to sign off on Raw's maybe-final FFH by repeating what happened from the Wyatt/Orton stuff. THRILLING. Also, maybe if this sets Bray down a new path on SD, we can get past all of the past week or so's worth of questionable decisions.

[Edited on 10-15-2019 by Il Palazzo]





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 03:19 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I liked evil Asuka stomping on Natty's arm. That was a nice touch.

The whole draft premise is dumb. Nobody cares who goes to what network, and just announcing the names doesn't make anyone want to watch. Maybe, just maybe if they'd ever stuck to brand-exclusivity in previous drafts for more than a few months it would be interesting, but as-is it's even more boring than if they hadn't done anything at all.

If they're trying to make it seem like a sport, there's no way in hell anyone would draft Liv. In kayfabe terms, I mean. She hasn't been on TV in months, never had a major singles win that I can remember and there's no indication she'll be coming back. I don't think her name has even been mentioned on TV since she left. Out of kayfabe, of course we all know what's probably going to happen, and I'm a fan of her, but within the story we've seen it makes no sense at all.

And that ending. Oof. Everything about that last segment was idiotic. Fiend/Rollins is heel/heel now? Seth found the funhouse? It's a real place with puppets? The table was pre-soaked in lighter fluid? So fucking stupid.

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posted on 10-15-2019 at 03:41 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Apologies to anyone who placed money on my prediction of "Miz to RAW."

Except: BLOCKBUSTER TRADE FORTHCOMING~! Booker T says so! Tune in tomorrow night, immediately following the ALCS on FS1 for details!!!!!

Neither Miz nor Kevin Owens actually appeared in person at all during the draft, and they would be the two most sensible guys to flip.

Also: as shitbrained as that last bit of RAW was, and as much as I'd like to sweep it under the rug by making Bray and Seth be on opposite brands, so we can go back to the Before Times, when Bray wasn't the worst part of the show twice in 8 days.... I don't think that's the direction we're getting.

So Bray has to come back to RAW in any "blockbuster trade." You can even have Seth "hold out" (another wonderful real-sports thing that Vince probably only recently found out about and would like to shittily parlay into a wrestling story) if USA doesn't trade for Bray.

Maybe something like Bray/Miz/TBD in exchange for KO/Others (with Andrade being a strong favorite given FOX's interest in international star power; the OC are also a better fit for SD, if you ask me)...

Generally concur with the notion that, in between the not-very-good story stuff, this was a sneakily good episode of WRESTLING. They even just put the women's tag division out there as a main event, and it held its own. Granted, I was fixated on Asuka (more than usual) so I could figure out 4 seconds earlier than the rest of the world when she loaded up the green mist, and just when I thought I had it figured out? No green mist. She materialized out of nowhere and won with a roll-up instead.

Somehow, the disappointment that I was wrong is superseded by the delight of being outsmarted. Unless the roll-up is just because Vince heard the planned finish and decided that there's no way a classy lady like Lacey ever takes a faceful of food coloring. To paraphrase Krusty the Klown, the gag works best when the sap's got dignity. And Lacey is nothing if not a fancified stuck-up sidekick in the vein of Bob or Mel.

As far as tonight's supplemental picks go, I think Sonya/Mandy, the IIconics, and AoP are certain to be assigned to one brand or the other. The rest join Cesaro and others on a list of stars who might be (purposely) funneled to NXT, or who might just be entering creative limbo (see Luke Harper, who still has not signed a new contract).

The "injured list" also got treated oddly, as Samoa Joe was said to be off-limits, but he got drafted. Also, Drew McIntyre and Jinder Mahal both got drafted despite being a bit away from active duty. Then you have the Usos/Naomi, Matt Hardy, and a few others who aren't injured, but just being kept off TV, but who will be brought back under the Free Agency Clause. Sheamus is close to returning from legit injury. Jeff Hardy? Ummmm, less said the better, probably. Edge and Ronda Rousey probably deserve to be mentioned in this paragraph, too.

We'll see. I will say that I expected more out of picking Teams Hogan and Flair tonight, but zero got done. With Survivor Series on the horizon after Saudi Arabia, I wonder if they aren't trying to craft a more artful way to do back-to-back 5 vs. 5 matches, where the second one will have to be RAW vs. SD?

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posted on 10-15-2019 at 04:51 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I think an Orton & Rey Mysterio for Wyatt trade is the most likely outcome. Don’t see any reason for Rey to not be on Fridays, and Orton and The Revival shouldn’t be broken up. Andrade is dating Charlotte, so he wouldn’t get flipped without Charlotte...and you’d also have to flip Vega and Black.

Seriously, Orton and Rey for Bray is as tidy as you can get.

Plus I want to think nobody is stupid enough to promote a Bray vs Seth match and not pull the trigger this time. I mean we know Vince can be that stupid...but that doesn’t mean he will be.

A major title change would also likely make the Blood Money Show more important, thus ensuring more Blood Money.

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posted on 10-15-2019 at 05:12 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I unfortunately foresee a future in which Lacey Evans is the red white and blue babyface who saves Smackdown from Sasha & Bayley. I hope I am wrong.

Not really sure who there is for Becky to fight. Charlotte again? Alexa & Nikki? NATALYA?!?! I feel like she's in a holding pattern until Nia is cleared or Ronda comes back.

The best option would be Asuka, who's an amazing heel and would have killer matches with her. But she's in the tag team division right now and is probably likely to stay there.

Viking Raiders getting the titles is good.





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 04:10 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I'm just glad that drafts are an infrequent thing. The order of 'picks' is always a very head-scratching thing.





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 04:38 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by GodEatGod
I unfortunately foresee a future in which Lacey Evans is the red white and blue babyface who saves Smackdown from Sasha & Bayley. I hope I am wrong.


It's funny you mention that, because I've thought for a while now that the WWE would pull a "Lex Luger" with Lacey at some point and have her suddenly become a babyface. With her real-life military background, along with just her look and physique, she seems like someone Vince would want as one of the top faces of the women's division.

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posted on 10-15-2019 at 04:41 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I know that the story was the war rooms existed to make the draft seem more legit. You know what would have made the draft seem more legit? Don't draft a buncha fuckin' humps like Jinder Mahal, Akira Tozawa and Liv Morgan, while leaving The Usos, Cesaro and the Hardys on the board.

Also, after he was chosen, I actually said out loud, "who the fuck is Humberto Whatever*?"

*I can't even remember his last name now. But it doesn't matter since it will be dropped soon enough.





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posted on 10-15-2019 at 05:46 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by the goon

It's funny you mention that, because I've thought for a while now that the WWE would pull a "Lex Luger" with Lacey at some point and have her suddenly become a babyface. With her real-life military background, along with just her look and physique, she seems like someone Vince would want as one of the top faces of the women's division.


I'm torn over whether I want them to try this or not. Lacey is remarkably unlikable (somewhere between Corbin and Lars) and I'd love to see the crowd shit on any attempts to push her as a face, but I would also hate her going over any other woman on the roster in that attempt. I kind of wish they'd just have Sarah Logan crush her into next year.

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posted on 10-15-2019 at 06:50 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I feel like absolutely zero people in WWE have ever watched a draft in their life. I can suspend my disbelief about most things wrestling, but I'm told this is how a billion-dollar company runs its business.
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posted on 10-15-2019 at 10:45 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Trade Rusev, Lashley, Rowan, and Jinder for Ali, Daniel Bryan, Bray, and Nakamura (to get Zayn, too) and I won’t even have to watch Smackdown anymore. Just have Nakamura lose the IC belt this week to who gives a shit and I guess Miz can come over, too because of his show.
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posted on 10-16-2019 at 01:44 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
The trade was Bliss and Cross to Smackdown for future draft picks. Seriously. Moving along.





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posted on 10-16-2019 at 01:57 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Raw used two separate draft picks to select people who were listed as a tag team and thus available as a single selection and then traded them for nothing.








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Il Palazzo
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posted on 10-16-2019 at 02:03 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I like that this was apparently framed as a "blockbuster trade." Yes. It's an EPIC move to give up two people for something to be considered at a future point. And also continuing to invalidate the usually mentioned "teams might get broken up" concept that seems to rarely ever happen.

Hopefully, the next blockbuster trade is just a mild suggestion that they might move someone from one show to another in exchange for a DIFFERENT person from the other show.





Oh, I love legitimate theatre.

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posted on 10-16-2019 at 02:19 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by williamssl
Raw used two separate draft picks to select people who were listed as a tag team and thus available as a single selection and then traded them for nothing.





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