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Author: Subject: OOfficial Discussion Thread for: RAW (September 11, 2017)
OORick
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posted on 9-11-2017 at 07:49 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
OOfficial Discussion Thread for: RAW (September 11, 2017)

Tonight on RAW: WWEU Champ Brock Lesnar shows up for a rare appearance, and has a tough act to follow... last week, his #1 Contender at the upcoming No Mercy PPV Braun Strowman broke a steel cage (and Big Show, in the process) in the visually impressive climax to RAW... Lesnar has his own history of making things go BOOM with Big Show, but in the game of What Have You Done For Me Lately?, Brock (or more likely, Paul Heyman) needs to muster up a response that reminds us of what the here-and-now Lesnar is capable of...

John Cena vs. Roman Reigns is the semi-main-event in 2 weeks at No Mercy, and is humming along nicely, as the result of a pair of rather compelling verbal confrontations so far... but they've avoided any physical hostilities (for 2 weeks, they were forced tag partners; last week, when Cena crushed Roman on the mic, Reigns responded by begging for the fight, Cena toyed with him for a bit, and then walked away)... either they break the seal tonight, or they do the counter-point where Reigns scores the nasty verbal point, and Cena is the one who wants to fight, only to have Reigns play it cool...

The vast majority of the undercard is set in stone, too: (1) Ambrose & Rollins will defend the tag titles against Sheamus & Cesaro, and in the meantime, can just keep on delivering all kinds of superb in-ring action in various combinations, as well as pitch-perfect guest commentary... (2) as a result of a unique stipulation in a tag match last week, the women's title match at the PPV will now be a Fourway, with Alexa Bliss defending against Sasha Banks, Nia Jax, and Emma; Nia is now undeniably on the way to full babyface status, with the 4-way acting as another incremental step without jumping all the way ahead to the inevitable Nia vs. Alexa feud... (3) Enzo Amore is officially the #1 Contender to Neville's Cruiserweight Title, after winning a 5-way match on "205 Live" last week; but given HOW Enzo won (by doing almost nothing other than his prematch promo, until the very last moment, and then, he beat Cedric Alexander with a handful of tights), you gotta wonder if there won't be some kind of subtext here that starts moving Enzo towards a heel turn.... and (4) we are, in fact, getting another chapter in Finn Balor vs. Bray Wyatt, and the alleged reason why we're supposed to care is that Wyatt has challenged Balor to leave "The Demon" behind, and face him like a man, because without his Demon Crutch, Balor is nothing.... whee?

The only thing that's really wide open is the IC Title situation.... Miz successfully defended it on free TV last week, against Jeff Hardy (and did so in clean, decisive fashion), but continues to rail GM Kurt Angle about not giving adequate respect to the IC Belt and the man who carries it so proudly... ergo, Angle's "son" Jason Jordan remains as viable a candidate to somehow wind up with the PPV title shot as anyone (especially after a stellar in-ring performance against Cena last Monday)...

Beyond that, you have some other useful pieces that can be deployed to create a match for the PPV Pre-Show (or for the PPV itself, if the CW Match is kicked to the pre-show)... pretty much anything with the Hardys is sure to fit the bill; the other option would be spinning up little story arc for Elias Sampson...

That is all. End communication.

The flOOr is yours, OO Nation. Don't wait till after 11pm to post, either. Pre-show previewing and prognosticating is certainly welcome. So discuss, debate, and rate!

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First 9
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posted on 9-11-2017 at 08:25 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Cena vs Braun is taking place tonight. Are they against some big season premier from other channels? Talk about blowing your wad.

Also, Reigns gets his turn to whip Jason Jordan around. If JJ does end up becoming a big deal, it'll be a pretty cool trivial note that his first stand out singles matches were against the top guys of the two era before his.

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Count Zero
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posted on 9-11-2017 at 09:02 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
MONDAY NIGHT NFL SPORTSBALL!!!!!!!!!

That might be the thing they are counter-programming against?

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Jazzman
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posted on 9-11-2017 at 10:29 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Would be more effective if they had advertised it more than a few hours in advance.

Partially because of that, I am expecting (and kinda hoping for) a non-finish. I'd rather have more eyeballs on the product if Cena jobs and NO WAY can Braun take the pinfall loss.

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OORick
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posted on 9-11-2017 at 10:44 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
That's what I get for actually being pro-active, and taking advantage of a break in the afternoon to do the RAW Preview.... an hour later, WWE announces Cena vs. Strowman, and completely changes the narrative.

Instead of "basic 2 weeks out show in service of a PPV," we now have a pretty significant match to ponder. With both Lesnar and Reigns in the house, I don't expect anything decisive, but it's still a damned big move by WWE to throw it out there in a spazzy plea to keep viewers from watching MNF.

My hope is some kind of Strowman in the Middle drama... Reigns shows up to screw Cena, but instead of taking advantage to pin Cena, Strowman lets his still-simmering hatred of Reigns get the better of him. Strowman seeks to destroy Reigns via some nefarious stunt, only to have Shining White Knight Cena ACTUALLY AID REIGNS, his hated PPV opponent (out of 1 part decency and 2 parts Hey He's Mine).

Then, while Cena and Strowman argue, Brock Happens, and everybody gets at least 3 tickets to Suplex City. Or something like that.


Rick

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Il Palazzo
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 12:07 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
While I still find the yelling added to the beginning of Rollins' theme to be meh, adding some vocals to Jordan's theme works fairly well. And now he feels less generic I guess!

Edit: If Cena's got something to say to Roman, hopefully Roman can remember what it is he has to say back to Cena this time.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by Il Palazzo]





You did it, Nibbles. Now chew through my ball sack.

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Count Zero
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 12:33 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
"I've had more good matches in 2 years than you have in--" BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

That first part was Boooman, the ending was me.

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Il Palazzo
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 12:35 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I feel like we can just coast on Cena and Reigns delivering dueling promos for the next several years and it won't ever stop being entertaining. It will definitely become increasingly cringe worthy, but I suspect I'd still take pleasure in it.

Roman, if you know the correct guy, maybe use that guy to get some promo delivery tips.

Edit: Dammit, Cena. I keep feeling bad for Reigns, but at the same time not necessarily.

Edit 2: MATCH OF THE NIGHT, FOLKS. Fun little brawl, though. And +1 for Sheamus' kilt falling off mid-fight.

Edit 3: I missed most of it, but a fun end to that Cena/Strowman match. Also confusing with the steps to the face resulting in nothing, but a powerslam onto the steps earning a DQ. That Graves then commented on during the replay. Maybe the initial steps hit was meant to be while the ref somehow wasn't paying attention?

Edit 4: A wild Jamie Noble/Dean Malenko appears! I really want WWE to put out a Malenko DVD set or something now. I always liked his WCW stuff. And maybe the WWE stuff? It's been long enough nostalgia's set in for the WCW time, but the WWE time is somehow much fuzzier, beyond him having the vaguely Bond-ish entrance theme.

Edit 5: A night of worky-shooty promos! Maybe next week Roman and Enzo will randomly collide and just unload on each other. But really, Slepp bless Miz.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by Il Palazzo]





You did it, Nibbles. Now chew through my ball sack.

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anglefan85
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 02:32 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
The last time Miz shot this hard, Maryse got pregnant.





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Sam Is Neat
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 02:32 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Il Palazzo
I feel like we can just coast on Cena and Reigns delivering dueling promos for the next several years and it won't ever stop being entertaining. It will definitely become increasingly cringe worthy, but I suspect I'd still take pleasure in it.

Roman, if you know the correct guy, maybe use that guy to get some promo delivery tips.

Edit: Dammit, Cena. I keep feeling bad for Reigns, but at the same time not necessarily.

Edit 2: MATCH OF THE NIGHT, FOLKS. Fun little brawl, though. And +1 for Sheamus' kilt falling off mid-fight.

Edit 3: I missed most of it, but a fun end to that Cena/Strowman match. Also confusing with the steps to the face resulting in nothing, but a powerslam onto the steps earning a DQ. That Graves then commented on during the replay. Maybe the initial steps hit was meant to be while the ref somehow wasn't paying attention?

Edit 4: A wild Jamie Noble/Dean Malenko appears! I really want WWE to put out a Malenko DVD set or something now. I always liked his WCW stuff. And maybe the WWE stuff? It's been long enough nostalgia's set in for the WCW time, but the WWE time is somehow much fuzzier, beyond him having the vaguely Bond-ish entrance theme.

Edit 5: A night of worky-shooty promos! Maybe next week Roman and Enzo will randomly collide and just unload on each other. But really, Slepp bless Miz.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by Il Palazzo]


The only thing I really remember about Malenko's WWE run was that insane top rope reversal into a DDT he put on Scotty 2 Hotty at one of their PPVs. I havent seen it in forever, but I remember it looking devastating.

Edit: It was Backlash 2000, and for the LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT Championship. And it is still impressive 17 years later.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by Sam Is Neat]

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Matte
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 02:42 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Sam Is Neat
The only thing I really remember about Malenko's WWE run was that insane top rope reversal into a DDT he put on Scotty 2 Hotty at one of their PPVs. I havent seen it in forever, but I remember it looking devastating.







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Il Palazzo
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 02:45 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Woohoo! New reply!

I looked that match up on the Tubes of You, and that moment was pretty cool.

I feel like I just missed an amusing match. Maybe.

ALSO, in order to go back and touch on a moment I didn't get a chance to when it happened due to laptop issues, can WWE not let Kalisto do anything of note? I feel like we've seen Elias Nolastname beat him about a hundred times in the past few months. I think maybe just two, but Elias Samsomething seemingly being unable to do anything that goes beyond a single night makes it feel like so many more. Similarly, Goldust's heel turn sure did result in a massive push for him and R-Truth as singles!





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posted on 9-12-2017 at 02:46 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Matte
quote:
Originally posted by Sam Is Neat
The only thing I really remember about Malenko's WWE run was that insane top rope reversal into a DDT he put on Scotty 2 Hotty at one of their PPVs. I havent seen it in forever, but I remember it looking devastating.




Little known fact about that move: Scotty 2 Hotty died from it.

He is now dead.

Dean Malenko killed him.

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williamssl
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 03:38 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
If these Cena/Reigns segments are scripted, the scriptwriter writing for Roman sucks.





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salmonjunkie
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 04:11 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Kalisto needs to be on 205 Live STAT.
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 06:17 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I take it I missed yet another Cena Promo Stool Pushening on Reigns and Miz Mouth Murdering someone? Fucking awesome.

I guess it's not all bad though. I've bagged and tagged seven looters so far. Gotta focus on the positives in times like this.





Originally posted by DKBroiler
She looks so different when not in character as a jizz dartboard. What an amazing performer on so many levels.
Side note, anyone else think her finisher should be known as Paige’s Stuck Together?

Catch-As-Catch-Can: The Non-Specific Wrestling Thread

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posted on 9-12-2017 at 08:12 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Sam Is Neat
quote:
Originally posted by Il Palazzo
I feel like we can just coast on Cena and Reigns delivering dueling promos for the next several years and it won't ever stop being entertaining. It will definitely become increasingly cringe worthy, but I suspect I'd still take pleasure in it.

Roman, if you know the correct guy, maybe use that guy to get some promo delivery tips.

Edit: Dammit, Cena. I keep feeling bad for Reigns, but at the same time not necessarily.

Edit 2: MATCH OF THE NIGHT, FOLKS. Fun little brawl, though. And +1 for Sheamus' kilt falling off mid-fight.

Edit 3: I missed most of it, but a fun end to that Cena/Strowman match. Also confusing with the steps to the face resulting in nothing, but a powerslam onto the steps earning a DQ. That Graves then commented on during the replay. Maybe the initial steps hit was meant to be while the ref somehow wasn't paying attention?

Edit 4: A wild Jamie Noble/Dean Malenko appears! I really want WWE to put out a Malenko DVD set or something now. I always liked his WCW stuff. And maybe the WWE stuff? It's been long enough nostalgia's set in for the WCW time, but the WWE time is somehow much fuzzier, beyond him having the vaguely Bond-ish entrance theme.

Edit 5: A night of worky-shooty promos! Maybe next week Roman and Enzo will randomly collide and just unload on each other. But really, Slepp bless Miz.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by Il Palazzo]


The only thing I really remember about Malenko's WWE run was that insane top rope reversal into a DDT he put on Scotty 2 Hotty at one of their PPVs. I havent seen it in forever, but I remember it looking devastating.

Edit: It was Backlash 2000, and for the LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT Championship. And it is still impressive 17 years later.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by Sam Is Neat]



I don't think I remember him doing it in WWE but my favorite move of all time was Malenko's top rope gutbuster. I only remember seeing him do it a few times.

Nvrmnd. It was from the second rope and looking at a few youtubes, it's not as impressive compared to some of the stuff these guys are doing these days.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by CVD39]

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posted on 9-12-2017 at 08:26 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
When Miz was calling out Enzo saying that Enzo cheats and Neville doesn't have to cheat because he's a pro always working on his game I thought Enzo shoulda shot (shooted?) back with something along the lines of "when was your last clean win? If you didn't need these bozos to help you win or that bimbo, then it was some other bozo or bimbo that came before them. I think the last clean win I remember you having was against some jobber back on Sunday Night Heat!" Instead, we got more Enzo related garbage. Yawn.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by CVD39]

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GodEatGod
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 03:29 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I'm beyond burned out on worked shoot promos. It's starting to feel like cheap heat, like the writers can't be bothered to make a feud compelling without using RUMORZ . And maybe they can't, but that doesn't make me like it any better. Roman and Cena both look like assholes in this feud - I don't know who's going to win but I'm pretty sure I don't give a shit.

If they want to get Jason Jordan over, they can do worse things than just give him long matches and let him get over with workrate.

Nia and Alexa's relationship is really confusing, but they're both pretty hot in entirely different ways.

I'm impressed by how totally they seem to have invested in Braun Strowman. He annihilated both Brock Lesnar and John Cena in the same night and didn't seem to break a sweat with either. I hope that doesn't lead to the BIG SWERVE and they job him out to Lesnar at No Mercy - Braun's ready now and they need to strike while the iron's hot.





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Paddlefoot
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 03:50 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Oddly enough, no matter what some of us think of him, Enzo would be the one among the current talent who mostly likely can pull off a super-hot no-script-just-wing-it promo. The only time I've seen Enzo botch a promo was a few weeks back where he had that "and here's annuder thing..." moment and that seemed like it happened more because they overloaded him with too many talking points and he simply forgot one as opposed to him just fucking up. Whatever else he is there's no doubt he's on the top tier of the yapping aspect of the show.

[Edited on 9/12/2017 by Paddlefoot]





You know, everyone says it's not supposed to make sense, like that's the whole point, dude. And I'm just saying, you know, that's like an excuse for lazy storytelling. Just don't sell me shite and tell me it's gold, all right? I might be stoned, but I'm not high. You know what I mean?
- Cassidy from Preacher, commenting on The Big Lebowski and/or professional wrestling

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Count Zero
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 04:31 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by janerd75
I take it I missed yet another Cena Promo Stool Pushening on Reigns and Miz Mouth Murdering someone? Fucking awesome.

I guess it's not all bad though. I've bagged and tagged seven looters so far. Gotta focus on the positives in times like this.
The Legend of Janerd grows....

He killed SEVEN LOOTERS at one blow....job?

And I would say that Enzo is this era's Road Dogg. In this case, I'm making the mic-work parallel, but I'm sure there are other lines of comparison one could draw if one wanted to.

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posted on 9-12-2017 at 05:24 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
The fact that they mentioned all the backstage crap regarding Enzo makes me think management is over it(or never gave a shit). They set the promo up so Enzo could throw a rebuttal. Wasn't a particularly strong come back but the fact that he just didn't quietly take it says something.

Also, Miz is so directionless on RAW.

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SaiyaJinDX
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 06:35 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
The Cena-Reigns promos have been very amusing but almost entirely because of Cena. As someone mentioned before, whoever is writing Reigns stuff is TERRIBLE. Everything that is coming out of his mouth is untrue. The whole "I've had more great matches in two years than you have in your entire career." Umm... the US title open challenges happened within the last two years and the majority of those were excellent matches. I can barely think of one excellent match Reigns has had in the last year (outside of the four-way that just happened at Summerslam and most of that credit does not go to him). And I'm a guy who doesn't flat out hate Reigns!

But that was just one example, I'm blanking on other specific ones he said, but almost every "diss" on Cena was pure BS. Doing that takes me out of it. If you're going to diss someone, make sure what you're making fun of is true or you've got no credibility. People may "ooh" and "ahh" at some of the takes, but that's because some are sheep and only care about the punchline and not whether it's true or not. I feel like we're running Presidential debates here...

Make fun of the fact he doesn't cinch in his STF, that he wears jorts, his relationship with Nikki, how he may hold people down, etc but don't make stuff up just to get a good line across (and good is relative here). That's just lame.

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williamssl
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 07:36 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Good: Cena calling out and making fun of Reigns' failed drug test
Bad: Reigns calling Cena a punk-ass bitch.

Good: Cena making fun of Reigns' mic skills
Bad: Reigns saying things that are so blatantly untrue that Cena's reaction is to laugh part 1: # of good matches in past 2 years)

Good: Cena making fun of "My yard" and "that guy"
Bad: Reigns saying things that are so blatantly untrue that Cena's reaction is to laugh part 2: Raw's ratings and revenues being all because of Reigns

It could go on, but that's what it has basically been.

Just go back and watch the Rock's promos on Cena from a few years back. Or Miz's from the lead-in to Wrestlemania. That's how you do it.

[Edited on 9-12-2017 by williamssl]





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Il Palazzo
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posted on 9-12-2017 at 07:41 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Also further adding to the tragic nature of Roman's shots back at Cena includes the fact that he brings up ticket sales during a RAM that had quite a few empty seats. If only someone in production had gone rogue and immediately cut to a shot of an area covered up by tarps when he brought it up.





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