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Author: Subject: Showdown FAQs
Ecosystem
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posted on 5-29-2011 at 09:09 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Yeah, looking at that, it's hard to argue the Diva Search wasn't kind of a success for WWE. I mean, it took spots from a lot of talented women in the indies and was tremendously harmful on that front, but they got some compelling characters. Christy/Maria/Michelle/Ashley/Kristal/Layla/Rosa/Maryse/Eve/Tiffany isn't a bad success rate for what they were going for (and I'm not counting non-wrestling characters like Joy and Lena, who tended to be shorter-tenure anyway).





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Matte
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posted on 5-30-2011 at 01:22 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Last batch of round 1 polls going up tonight so that we can move onto round 2 by Wednesday. Then I'll finally start leaving each set of polls up for a week at a time, instead of rushing them along. I really just wanted to get past round 1.





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doctorb
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posted on 5-30-2011 at 03:42 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Wow, I didn't even vote in all of the last section.





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posted on 5-31-2011 at 06:43 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
So a thought I had while reviewing these polls, and also going back through the OO Fantasy Drafts in preparation for a similar draft at Pun's...

Would there be interest in a Women's Wrestling Draft?

Basically, the way we've run OO Fantasy Drafts in the past: we draft wrestlers we like in a round-robin order (so if we have 10 people and you have pick #10, you start the next round with pick #11) and then we put together wrestling cards with our final roster, and people cast votes to decide which they like best in a tournament. You can see more to the link above.

Although we've been exposed here to 400 or so female wrestlers here with at least 75-100 no-names, it's still a smaller pool--so I'd like to run a smaller draft with a few interested players (say, 8-12 people) with 25 rounds instead of 42, in order to keep it both speedy and interesting.

Thoughts? I know there's a Pun's draft right now, and I don't know when the next full OO Draft starts, but this would be a shorter, fun exercise that we could start maybe after Round 2 of this showdown.





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doctorb
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posted on 6-2-2011 at 04:41 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
How long are these polls going to be open, now? A week was too long at first but then the last couple seemed to close in just 2 or 3 days.

Is there going to be a standard? A week, 5 days, or is it just until the votes slow down and there's a clear winner?





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Matte
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posted on 6-2-2011 at 05:00 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Matte
Last batch of round 1 polls going up tonight so that we can move onto round 2 by Wednesday. Then I'll finally start leaving each set of polls up for a week at a time, instead of rushing them along. I really just wanted to get past round 1.






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williamssl
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posted on 6-14-2011 at 11:41 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Update the polls already you slacker.





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BigStevieCool
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posted on 6-17-2011 at 02:45 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Matte,

First, thanks for running this whole thing. Pretty awesome idea.

Second, I have a suggestion that you can either use or ignore in your ultimate wisdom.

I know that you plan on posting different pics of the girls as the rounds progress. May I suggest that you do that cumulatively? As in, during round 2, you post the pics that you posted in round 1 as well as the new pics, and in round 3 you post the pics from round 1 and 2 as well as the new pics.

The reason I suggest this is that 1) more pics are always good, and 2) it gives a broader view of the girls. For some girls there are only a few pics to go around, but for others there are lots of pics, some hot, some less than hot. If the less perfect pics were used in round 1, it's still worth including them in the later rounds so that voters can see the total picture of the girl, not just the best pics of her.

For me, I just caught onto this for round 2, so I've missed out on some of the round 1 pics as well -- it gives perspective.

And i just like looking at more pics of hot chicks. :-p

There may be reasons not to do this -- limits on post sizes, threads become too long, etc. As I said, I leave it to your wisdom to decide what's best.

Again, thanks for the effort of running this!

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williamssl
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posted on 6-17-2011 at 03:55 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
A little secret:

You see this Internet thing....it is big. Lots and lots of stuff on it. Including pictures. Of girls. Videos too.

And you might be thinking....hey great and all but how would I ever find those things on this apparently big Internet?

Another secret:

There are these things called search engines. You type in what you are looking for and they do all the hard work.









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BigStevieCool
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posted on 6-17-2011 at 08:23 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Not gonna happen. I'm too lazy to even go back and look at the pics from round 1. And there are only 10 pages of threads there. too much effort to go back and search for all the pics every time. They all need to be in one place, for my consideration.

Thanks for the suggestion though.

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Matte
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posted on 6-22-2011 at 09:36 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by BigStevieCool
Not gonna happen. I'm too lazy to even go back and look at the pics from round 1. And there are only 10 pages of threads there. too much effort to go back and search for all the pics every time. They all need to be in one place, for my consideration.

Thanks for the suggestion though.

I'm going to use this as my own response to your suggestion.

It's a great suggestion, and one that I would have done if it had been suggested at the beginning of the showdown, but at this point, it would require too much backtracking and I already spend enough time once a week searching for pictures and posting the polls (which is more time consuming than you'd think since you can only post once every 90 seconds - 90 seconds x 23 polls = over 30 minutes of nothing but waiting and then clicking the "Post Reply" button - and then add in the time spent collecting 2-4 pictures of each girl - 23 polls = 46 girls = 92-184 pictures - and then add in the time spent actually CREATING the polls, which requires 23 tabs to be open at once and all of them having to have image tags, names, poll options, etc. typed up, plus image URLs have to be copied/pasted one-by-one, blah blah blah poor me).

Hoping to get the new polls posted tonight, by the way.





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doctorb
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posted on 6-23-2011 at 04:43 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
How many girls did we finally start with?

And not counting the qualifying round, how many rounds are we looking at?





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Matte
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posted on 6-23-2011 at 08:55 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by doctorb
How many girls did we finally start with?

450 I think.
quote:
And not counting the qualifying round, how many rounds are we looking at?

I don't know anymore. The original plan is on the first page, but the 3-ways happened and the original brackets were scrapped.





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doctorb
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posted on 6-23-2011 at 09:09 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I can't believe I just went and counted off the results list but I got 215 winners from Round one. So adding 6 losers from the qualifying and an extra 25 from the 3 way round that means we started with 461.

Assuming there aren't any more 3 ways or anything crazy, this will go, lets see, how does it work with an odd number? 214 to 107 to 59 to 30 to 15 to 8 to 4 to 2 to Velvet Sky, that's 9 rounds.





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Matte
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posted on 6-27-2011 at 01:05 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Putting up the last set of round 2 polls tonight. Only 13 in this set. Round 3 begins soon!





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OORick
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posted on 6-27-2011 at 02:39 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
By my count, this last set of polls means there will be 105 girls advancing to Round 3 (4 batches of 23 polls is 92 winners, plus the 13 winners from this abbreviated set).

An uneven number is anathema to a bracket-style tourney, so my curious mind now demands that Matte reveal his plans for dealing with bracketing now that we are down to a number that we can wrap our heads around! Byes? Three-ways? Round robins? DEMAND TO KNOW~!

FWIW, I am a man who has spent the past 3 years perfecting and tweaking a new format for March Madness that allows for expansion, but not all the way to 128 teams (which would be stupid), so my brain is trained to think in terms of taking unusual numbers and reducing them down to 64 via byes/play-ins/etc... ergo, my brain instantly knows that the "simple" thing to do would be to assign 23 "byes" (I think Matte could be trusted to pick 23 women who would have zero chance of being eliminated in this round), and put the other 82 women into polls that will result in 41 winners. Then, 23 + 41 = 64, and we can actually proceed with a properly seeded single-elimination tournament.

That said, I'll include another proposal that's less "simple" and requires one extra step. Because hey, half the fun so far has been the wackiness of the bracketing, so why make it simple now?

Give byes to 15 women (again, I think it'd be easy to find 15 out of 105 that we all agree are safe from elimination at this point), put the other 90 into polls, resulting in 45 winners (15+45=60). Then, for our extra step, the top 10 vote-getting losers out of the 45 are all placed into one giant 10-way poll, where the top 4 vote getters get a second chance to advance, and fill out the field of 64, which again is where it is possible to proceed with a properly seeded single elimination tournament. [Or instead of one 10-way poll, we could do three 3-way polls, with each winner AND a wild card getting a second chance, or some other way of deciding upon 4 "play-in" winners to round out the field of 64.]

Yours in a Dictatorial and Prickish Demand for Structure,
Rick






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lz4005
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posted on 6-27-2011 at 02:54 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Anyone else bothered by the fact that 82% of the winners so far in round two have been the name appearing first?
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Matte
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posted on 6-27-2011 at 03:12 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lz4005
Anyone else bothered by the fact that 82% of the winners so far in round two have been the name appearing first?
Yes, I am. You guys need to change up your voting strategy of "vote for the first name listed."
quote:
Originally posted by OORick
ergo, my brain instantly knows that the "simple" thing to do would be to assign 23 "byes" (I think Matte could be trusted to pick 23 women who would have zero chance of being eliminated in this round), and put the other 82 women into polls that will result in 41 winners. Then, 23 + 41 = 64, and we can actually proceed with a properly seeded single-elimination tournament.
That's the option I'll probably go with. And good thing it was mentioned now, or I probably would have overlooked it and we would end up with a wacky bracket and a Nitro Girl would somehow win.





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doctorb
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posted on 6-27-2011 at 04:04 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
How did we go from 215 to 105? Did I count wrong or were there a couple of names listed twice?





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OOMike
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posted on 6-27-2011 at 05:56 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lz4005
Anyone else bothered by the fact that 82% of the winners so far in round two have been the name appearing first?



I blame Matte for listing the more popular (hotter) woman first...







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posted on 6-27-2011 at 06:36 PM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I order to avoid arguments over who deserves a bye and who doesn't (even though it's just Matte deciding, ultimately), may I suggest that the byes be determined by percentage of victory in round 2? The largest margins of victory get the byes. That avoids the need to debate over who the top 15 are, etc.

Just a suggestion.

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Matte
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posted on 6-28-2011 at 02:38 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by doctorb
How did we go from 215 to 105? Did I count wrong or were there a couple of names listed twice?

Yea, I don't know. If anyone cares to explain how that works, please do. All this number/math stuff is shorting out my brain.
quote:
Originally posted by BigStevieCool
I order to avoid arguments over who deserves a bye and who doesn't (even though it's just Matte deciding, ultimately), may I suggest that the byes be determined by percentage of victory in round 2? The largest margins of victory get the byes. That avoids the need to debate over who the top 15 are, etc.

More math!?





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Matte
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posted on 6-28-2011 at 07:15 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
Here's the list of byes I put together after a quick scan of all the names:

AJ Lee
Angelina Love
Beth Phoenix
Beulah McGillicutty
Brooke Adams
Christy Hemme
Daffney
Gail Kim
Kimona Wanalaya
Lita
Madison Rayne
Maria Kanellis
Mickie James
Molly Holly
Natalya Neidhart
Rosita
Sarita
Serena Deeb
Shelly Martinez
Stacy Keibler
Trish Stratus
Velvet Sky
Victoria

Which means round 3 polls will include:

Allison Danger
Allison Wonderland
Alundra Blayze
Amber O'Neal
Angela Fong
Annie Social
Ashley Massaro
Awesome Kong
Ayako Hamada
Becky Bayless
Britani Knight
Brittany Savage
Candice LaRae
Candice Michelle
Cheerleader Melissa
Chelsea
Cherry Bomb
Christie Ricci
Christina Crawford
Christina Von Eerie
Chyna
Crystal Louthan
Daizee Haze
Dawn Marie
Francine Fournier
Hiroko Suzuki
Ivory
Jackie Gayda
Jacqueline Moore
Jade Chung
Jemma Palmer
Jennifer Blake
Jessie McKay
Jillian Hall
Joy Giovanni
Kaitlyn
Katie Lea
Kelly Kelly
Kimberly Page
Krissy Vaine
Kristal Marshall
Lacey
Lacey Von Erich
Lauren Brooke
Layla El
Lena Yada
Lilian Garcia
Lizzy Valentine
LuFisto
Luna Vachon
Madison Eagles
Maryse Ouellet
Melina Perez
Mia Yim
Miss Elizabeth
Naomi Knight
Nidia
Nikki Bella
Nikki Matthews
ODB
Portia Perez
Rachel Summerlyn
Rain
Rebecca Knox
Rima Fakih
Rosa Mendes
Roxxi Laveaux
Ryan Shamrock
Sara Del Rey
Sexy Star
Shazza McKenzie
Sherri Martel
SoCal Val
Stacy Carter
Stephanie McMahon
Sunny
Taylor Wilde
Terri Runnels
Torrie Wilson
Traci Brooks
Vickie Guerrero
Woman

Of course, this is assuming that the current polls end up like this:

Gail Kim vs. Ann Brookstone
Shaniqua vs. Chyna
Torrie Wilson vs. Nitro Girl Syren
Traci Brooks vs. Wesna Busic
Brooke Adams vs. Rosetta Park
Bertha Faye vs. Jessie McKay
Victoria vs. Ariane Andrew
Sherri Martel vs. Aksana
Kimona Wanalaya vs. Jaime Koeppe
Mildred Burke vs. Jillian Hall
Ivory vs. Bobbie-Jo Anderson
Rima Fakih vs. Nitro Girl Gold
Woman vs. Tori

Dispute my list if you want, see if I care.





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OORick
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posted on 6-29-2011 at 04:12 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
I would lobby strenuously for both Steph and Sunny to be given byes; they both possess high levels of importance/relevance and hotness. Hell, Sunny is in the Hall of Fame, so who are we not to grant her a bit of immunity?

A notch below, very good cases could be made for: Ivory (exceptional career resume, tons of hotness), Sensational Sherri (incredibly talented, not entirely un-hot), and Elizabeth (proximate to many memorable moments, very hot). Lesser arguments could be made for: Madusa/Alundra (historical importance of bringing women's wrestling back to the US), Kharma/Kong (a latter day Madusa, albeit with less historical hindsight and not much hotness), and Layla (seemingly the one present day "Diva Search Loser" who is appreciated by all fans for her in-ring/on-mic improvements, and also, she's hot).

I like to be positive in my assessment of hot chicks, rather than nitpicking for flaws, so I'm less comfortable saying who I think should come off the list of byes to make room.... but to make room for Steph and Sunny, I guess I will admit that I don't see Shelley Martinez or Brooke Adams being among the top 23 remaining.

After that, you could poke holes in the cases of a few girls for brevity of careers/exposure (AJ, Rosita, Sarita, Serena, Daffney) or one-dimensionality (Christy, Maria), but I can obviously see why others would be attached to them in a way that I don't think there'd be massive support for Martinez/Adams, especially since my own secondary tiers of nominees have their own holes (unlike Steph/Sunny, who I really think are bulletproof to the round of 64).

Then again, if I'm so sure they're "bulletproof," then why should I care if they are forced to compete in an extra round? I guess I don't, and will defer to Matte's wisdom... but I thought I'd toss my 2 cents in just in case it informs the discussion.


Rick

[Edited on 6-29-2011 by OORick]






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Matte
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posted on 6-30-2011 at 08:53 AM Edit Post Reply With Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Matte
quote:
Originally posted by doctorb
How did we go from 215 to 105? Did I count wrong or were there a couple of names listed twice?

Yea, I don't know. If anyone cares to explain how that works, please do. All this number/math stuff is shorting out my brain.

Ok, I figured it out. First of all, there were 212 winners from round 1, not 215. You probably just counted wrong, no big deal. That means there should be 106 winners from round 2, not 105 like we were planning for, which means I forgot to enter two girls into round 2 polls. A quick scan of the results and I think MsChif and Jazz are those two. Righting that wrong right now by posting a new poll: MsChif vs. Jazz.

This also means that I can add 1 more girl to the list of byes. Based on Rick's suggestion, Sunny gets that spot.





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